Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

The question is asked only for self analysis, would you or could you stoop this low in society. Most of us will immediately say no way, but look at the article below and ask yourself, could it happen in my country, and would I at the very least look away and say nothing.





(CNN) -- Adolf Hitler, Pol Pot, Slobodan Milosevic. They are household names, infamous for masterminding genocide. But who were the foot soldiers who did the dirty work?
Recently discovered photos show Nazi officers relaxing at a retreat near Auschwitz.

Recently discovered photos show Nazi officers relaxing at a retreat near Auschwitz.
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In many cases they were equally notorious in their communities because they were the friends, neighbors and co-workers of those they raped, slaughtered and buried alive.

Nusreta Sivac watched ordinary people become killers while imprisoned in a concentration camp in Bosnia.

She saw prisoners beaten beyond recognition and watched camp guards force a Muslim prisoner to rape a Muslim woman in front of everyone.

She was shocked to see people she knew running the camp. "They acted as if they had never seen me before," she said. "It was difficult for me to understand how people could turn into beasts overnight." Video Watch as Nusreta tells her story �

While some perpetrators participate unwillingly -- they are forced to kill or face death themselves -- many ordinary people are manipulated into participating in the killing machine voluntarily.

Researchers say most perpetrators of genocide were not destined for murder and had never killed before.

"You don't have to be mentally ill or even innately evil or criminal. You can be ordinary, no better or worse than you or me, and commit killing or genocide," said Harvard psychiatrist Robert Lifton, who has studied Nazi doctors.

"The truth is that we all have the possibility for genocidal behavior."

Experts have reached a troubling conclusion: It was actually very easy for the architects of genocide to find more than enough ordinary people to do the killing.

Genocide is often the result of a "perfect storm." A country reeling from political and economic turmoil, a fanatical leader promising to make things better and a vulnerable population targeted for blame -- all combine in a blueprint for mass murder.

Architects of genocide use the same tools to execute their plan.

Group identity

Millions have been killed for being religious, ethnic or simply educated. Group identity is one of the foundations of genocide. This allegiance makes it easier for extremist leaders to stoke age-old animosities between groups.
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"We all divide the world into 'us' and 'them,' " said psychologist Ervin Staub, author of "The Roots of Evil: The Origins of Genocide and Other Group Violence."

"Some people are like 'us' because of nationality, religion, race, etc. Those that are not like 'us' are 'them.' "

"Group identity intensifies during difficult times," Staub said.

Jean-Bosco Bizimana, a Rwandan Hutu, slaughtered his Tutsi neighbors 14 years ago. Leaders of the genocide exploited the history of hatred between the Hutus and Tutsis to pit them against each other. But before the genocide, the two groups had overcome their hostility to live peacefully together.

"We were manipulated," Bizimana said. "The government pushed us to kill. Before that, we intermarried, we helped each other in daily life and we shared everything. We ourselves can't even believe what happened."

Bizimana's wife said her husband, "would go around with the mob, and to show them he was part of it, he would kill."

Perpetrators don't want to be seen as weak, and in a mob mentality, individual guilt seems to disappear.

"People will do almost anything in a group and will do anything not to be rejected," said psychologist Philip Zimbardo, a professor emeritus at Stanford and famous for his 1971 Stanford Prison Experiment, which divided student volunteers into "prisoners" and "guards" and showed how easily people could be induced to commit sadistic acts.

"They give up a sense of personal accountability and diffuse responsibility to the leader."

Propaganda and dehumanization

Genocidal regimes use propaganda to incite hatred. During the genocide in Bosnia, for example, a fictitious news report said Muslims were feeding Serb children to animals at the Sarajevo zoo.

When people feel threatened and endangered, they can be led to kill. "Most genocides are shaped on [a perceived need for] self-defense," said Christopher Browning, a University of North Carolina history professor who studied a Nazi police battalion.

Bizimana said Rwandan government radio broadcasts led him to kill. "When instructions come from the government, we believed it was the right thing to do," he said.

"People tend to believe the world is a just place," psychologist Staub said. So the targeted group "is seen as though they did something to deserve the suffering."

The propaganda machine portrays the victim group as less than human. In Rwanda, the Hutus called their Tutsi neighbors 'cockroaches.' In Cambodia, the Khmer Rouge said their victims were "worms." To the Nazis, Jews were "vermin."

Dehumanization is the most powerful psychological tool used in all mass murder and genocides, Zimbardo said. "Dehumanization blurs your vision. You look at these people and you do not see them as human."

Instead, the enemy is treated as a germ -- as something to eradicate, or else face the threat of infection.

"Purification is at the heart of genocide," said Harvard's Lifton. "In that purification ... [the killers] are healing."

Recently discovered photos show Nazi officers at a retreat near Auschwitz relaxing as though they are taking a break from a routine job, not an extermination factory. "In order to carry out the function of killing, one must instill in that environment a sense of ordinariness," said Lifton. Video Watch images of Nazis relaxing �

In the end, the masterminds of genocide see their visions play out: Foot soldiers carry out the mission and entire populations are displaced or killed.

Perpetrators and victims don't realize what they're involved in until it's too late, said Ben Kiernan, director of the Genocide Studies Program at Yale University.

"It's a conspiracy, a silent secret plan to set up a situation whereby the victims, who are unsuspecting, are brought into a conflict with a large number of people, many of whom are also unsuspecting," Kiernan said.

Looking back at their crimes, some perpetrators are now sorry for their actions, including Bizimana. "What we did to them in the past was very bad," he said. "Deep in my heart, I regret it."
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Bizimana has since reconciled with his surviving Tutsi neighbors, and is trying to build unity in his country.

"What happened," he vows, "will never happen again."
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All About Genocide � Nazi Party � Cambodia � Rwanda � Bosnia and Herzegovina

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...tml#cnnSTCText

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Normal thinking people would never do this...but i figure that under the right conditions at least 5% - 10% of the population that could be turned into killers based on race/religion/etc....and a larger percentage would turn a blind eye - this is more than enough to make a killing machine work.

Trust me I would never kill in these situations....I would kill to protect my family and myself....I would probably kill to protect others...even if there was a fair risk of being killed by doing so.....and if you follow my posts....I do not care for the predominant behavior of a lot of racial groups....I am prejudiced based on my experiences....so i do use race and other grouping as a profile tool ....all that said, I am also the guy on the highway changing tire for people regardless of their race....I've done this at least 20 times.....mostly to help a woman...but also older men and young kids.

I've often thought about how you can have genocide....and I think it only takes a very small percentage of brainwashed, shallow thinking folks to get the ball rolling....and our current society has been dunmbed down enough....that the future will be ripe for this.

I think that even in battle....I'd have to stop my fellow soldiers from killing when it is not needed. I would for sure frag a fellow soldier murdering citizens...or even commiting rape....youe, I'd be judge and jury and executioner right there all at once...otherwise I could not live with myself.

I think black america should think about this risk/threat ....there will be a lot of pissed off people when this finally crashs into near mad max....or full mad max....and there is a lot of blame to place at the inner-city black populations....they are 1 of the 3 spears that have ruined america.....along with banking and our global military.

Call me what you like....i do not really even care....just look at any major city and see the irresponsibility of the mostly black race....look at the crime, birth rate and welfare state.....and remember they are only 15% of the US population. I'm know I'm prejudiced - i pre-judge based on experience......but not to project hate....I just go with the odds/statistics and this requires me to use a broad brush to paint large groups.

I fear for them after the bottom falls out.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Ever heard of the Stanford prison experiment?

The wikipedia article is a good overview.

From the Stanford summary report:
"... Ordinary people, simply doing their jobs, and without any particular hostility on their part, can become agents in a terrible destructive process. Moreover, even when the destructive effects of their work become patently clear, and they are asked to carry out actions incompatible with fundamental standards of morality, relatively few people have the resources needed to resist authority. ..."

The earlier Milgram experiment is another point of interest.


I think a lot of people do not understand how "appealing to anauthority figure" is. Look at the things that people do here and now when they lose their ordinary jobs? It is commonly noted that the biggest hurdle to unemployment is overcoming the feelings of depression and failure.

-end-

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Depends on the situation...

Because I happen to be mad at him or don't like him... NO way... I'll just ignore or avoid him...

If somehow or something causes him to flip out, bust in my house looking to do my family or me real harm, then yea, I could smoke him with no hesitation...

Would I feel bad after wards... I dunno, depends on the situation...

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

I am very farmiliar with this...we covered this in a few classes i had in college. But, like i said....90% of the people are pretty stupid and would do what they are told or ordered. I do not think i would.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

No but when he was little I threatened to do so a couple of times

Oh btw he is my son :wink:

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

This pretty well sums up my view also. About the only difference is that under the situation where they were threatening my family there would be no feeling bad afterwords.

Maybe because unfortunately I have been in combat, those that threaten my loved ones would get no quarter. I would be sad that society came to that point, but not that I had protected my own.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

In order to preemptively avoid such a situation, I went shopping last week, and bought a bag of rice, and a couple jars of peanut butter for my neighbors. Maybe they will start thinking, and go buy more food. I figure if they have enough food, they wont need to bother me.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Good luck. Unless you are working with your neighbors to prepare, the less they know about how you are getting ready the better. If not, yours will be the first place they go.

In our area we get together to make sure as much as possible is covered. Such as I get the tractor, Joe gets an attachment, Sam gets a different one etc.

Works good. That way we are not spending extra on duplication for many things. We all end up with much more stuff that helps out.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Only if they are attacking me.

After the Nazi death camps a lot of research was done on those who saved people. They did not turn out, on the whole, to be more moral. Schindler for example, was pretty much a rogue. What they shared was an inability to dehumanize.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Interesting, Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Here is a 50 minute documentry on it:

<embed id="VideoPlayback" src="http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docid=6935924833200591885&hl=en&f s=true" style="width:400px;height:326px" allowFullScreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" type="application/x-shockwave-flash"> </embed>

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

During Desert Storm I recall AFRTS telling troops that Iraqi soldiers were throwing infant Kuwati babies out of incubators. Hey, whatever gets the boys in the mood for a little killing.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

All -

I kinda like my neighbors.

However, on the dark side, there is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome


scyth

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

I think the story's title/premise "They killed their neighbors: genocide's foot soldiers" is rather misleading. People were targeted along racial/tribal/religious distinctions -- culturally alike neighbor did not turn against neighbor.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

How do you get that video to play?

The prison experiment one.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Yup................

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

It plays when I hit the play button....try pasting this link instead. Be sure to remove the spacing:

http://video.google. com/videoplay?docid=6935924833200591885

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

This is where I need help trying to get my neighbors to WAKE UP! I have talked to my neighbors, left letters for them, with links to web sites siting the failing economy and different Alex Jones videos to watch, where to get food, how to store food ect. Last time I asked how their food storage was going they, I got "rolled eyes" and the other said they got some beans. They all thikn I am an Extreme Morman Food Storage paranoid person. Just because I tell them to stock up food. (BTW - I am not morman) What do you tell these 30 year old people who have never seen a bad time and dont understand that they wont be able to go to the grocery store and get food? Any and all help in trying to "learn" my neighbors would be of greatly appreciated!

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

A few years ago 3 of us went around to all our neighbors in about a two mile radius. Not that many as we all have land.

We got together and at first planned a big 4th of July picnic. At that time we talked things over and set up a (town hall) meeting for twice a year rotating between homes in the Summer and the Library meeting room in the Winter.

Took a bit but slowly things built up. First working on generators then listing all the different tools that would be necessary.

Made up a list of what different attachments needed for tractors etc and vryone picked off the list.

Now we have sort of a private tool rental store. Sign up lists for who needs what when etc.

I am lucky as there are a few veterans, and just plain ol working folks around. Have a DR. a DDS a vet, truck driver/equipment operator, logger. We are pretty well covered.

Really lucky with our area that's for sure.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Very nice Unalga, this is the way things should be. Sounds like you guys are ready to "Weather the Storm". :36_1_63:

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

I have given bulk dry foods to neighbors on four sides in the last 6 months. 3 of them have since been buying bulk storage food.
I hope that if things get unpleasant, or supplies are scarce I will have plenty of extra peanut butter and rice to give to those less prepared.
My philosophy is that I would much rather FEED someone than have to shoot them.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

This murderous group-think mentality is currently held by many Obama supporters. That's who we need to watch. If any group in America would fire up the ovens to kill the rest of us, it's the Flavor-Aid drinkers who think the new unconstitutional president-elect is a "god."

As for me "killing my neighbor," I am a friend to everyone, until they prove themselves to be my enemy. And at that point, they're no longer my "neighbor," but a disease that infects my community.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

I once had a physically large (6ft8/320 lbs,WWE type) neighbor.He was the most corrupt,drunkard, , bullying A**hole you would have ever met. we lived in a very rural Northern Michigan area at the time, he was from the city originally, whenever we had a storm that we lost power for more than a few hours , he would gather his family and rent a room in a hotel 40 miles away rather than "survive", I had always figured on taking him out right away in a SHTF scenario as i know he would have quickly tried to take my preps from me as he never had any. BTW , he was thrown in prison shortly after we moved for beating his wife and 7yr old daughter half to death because the wife argued with him over his purchase of a snowmobile, and the little girl tried to stop the beating, a true piece of work.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

This is me to a tee, only I would substitute Mexican. I'm the nicest guy you could meet but don't shit on me cuz now we have a big problem I don't take to kindly to being shat upon, mainly I treat all others in a kind and curtious manner. One term I might use to describe part of my persona would be "free floating hatred" and on the flip side "free floating kindness".
I'm the kinda guy that has and will go to blows over some asshole draping the Mexican flag all over his house or car.......and it's always some puke that's on the gubberment tit. They have ruined my home town and pretty much the whole state of Kali......yesterday Arnold announced a plan to get people to start bank accounts, he said half of the people in Kali don't have them.....I wasn't surprised.

Ruprick, what you said about kids and old folks, that's me exactly, but some of the kids around here get pretty ugly at a very early age .....it's sad and sickening.
Leaving the border open for a flood of illegal immigrants was a planned move, or chaos management if you will, to create distrust and civil unrest amongst the populous........and it's working.

It's probably rants like this that give GIM a black eye, I'm really not trying to offend, but there are millions of people in California who feel just like me, this mess could get real ugly some day.......sad.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

It is nearly impossible to describe ones character across an internet.....I know exactly what kind of person you are...probably just like me....and millions more jusy like us.....but there are simply not enough of us....that is what is sad and scary!

The problem is the "political correctness" of most educated/intelligent people.

The points I rant on about, I am sure, make me look like some kind of disgusting bigot....perhaps by definition I am in todays touchy feely fantasy world that is quickly imploding.

For me it is mostly a race issue as we are up to our necks in mostly blacks around here that have absolutely destroyed EVERYTHING! I cannot overstate the lever of ruin. In California/TX/NM/AZ...the exact same story can be said about Mexicans. In the hills of some of Western KY and West Verginia....you can kind of make the same statement about some white trash....but I've been to all of these 3 places...and it is just not that bad in the white areas....yes they are very poor....but not that much crime or threat to life as you see in black and mexican areas. Have you ever heard of "White Gang Voilence" in any area of the country? There are not bad ends of a white town that are so bad that you would not dare to go there.....in some places I would not suggest a black man going....but i'll tell you - i've been in some pretty red neck areas in bars where you better have your shit together when you walk in the door....and even in these places...I've seen a black guy come in and have a drink without trouble.....thats partially because of "cultural" change in young whites that emulate black urban "culture" in dress and music.....you know the type...white kid with baggy pants half way down to his knees....crooked hat...lots of bling....jungle beat rap pulsing from his radio....it is like he is pissed off he was not born black - MTV is his guiding beacon....don't get me wrong...I'll even listen to Kid Rock once in a while...

It is so far out of whack.....if a car pulls up to you with the bass so strong that it makes your windows buzz....you don't dare even look in that direction for fear they may get out of thier car and threaten you ......this if F'ed up! It should be all of us using our voice to say - turn that shit down befor i get out of my car and stomp you face in you idiot....and if everyone did this....the world would be much better. Why do we tolerate this crap?

The problem with political correctness....is that thinking folks...hard working responsible people.....can't touch these subjects without being seen as Racist....Bigots....Hateful....this is all bullshit!

We are just sick and tired of the destruction....irresponsibility....crime....entitl ement mentality.

I mostly go off on Black and Mexicans for this because the percentages of the idiots is much higher than that of other groups.....but it is in the whites as well. Our company "adopted a family" last Christmas....white gal ....19 years old with 2 kids and one more on the way.....I floated an email around the office suggesting we pool our funds and send her to the vet to be spayed.....it makes me want to puke.....this cannot hold a candle to the 29 yo black gal in flint with 10 kids....is that vomit i taste in my mouth?!?

this is directed at the World...not any particular people on GIM: I guess I will rant against all idiots.....but don't get all up my ass when I bitch about blacks or Mexicans....come on out to Flint/Detroit/Cleveland/Baltimore/Any non-South-West-State-Big-City.....and tell me they have not destroyed it...to the point that we must carry this human trash....to the point we will not survive as a nation. The Southwest and some areas of the S.E. are doubly blesses with both Blacks and Hispanic idiot breeding garbage. if you do not see it this way you are blind or stupid....because it is obvious where and why and who made this mess.

I'm probably too full of anger....and you can't see the super nice helpful person I am towards everyone regardless of color...but it is such a fire of disgust within me that I just about can't hold it in any longer.

We are very near the end of the tracks and the train has been building speed since i was a very young boy watching this unfold....I called it out at the age of about 12.....i'm now 42....i guess i had a reasonable ride for 30 years. But now it is over.....and my little children will be left to live in this wasteland created by irresponsible $#%&@!

I'm done now...and do not feel much better......

Do not read this the wrong way...but we need a person with some of the characteristics of .....I hate to say this....HITLER...to rise to power....I'm not talking genocide or concentration camps or hatred.....but the strong national pride and nation strengths.....youth education that teached responsibility...personal and civic. A sledge hammer voice that calls out these races and white trash - that we are mad as hell and not going to take it anymore! People that act this way should be scared for their lives that they may be lynched in the streets for their continued irresponsibility.....think of it as a leader that is as far from politically correct as you can be.....this would have to happen while there is still a majority of responsible hard working folks...and we are quickly reaching the tipping point on this opportunity....after that we will be like South Africa/Zimbabwae(sp?)/Haiti.....there will be no chance for correction of the problem at some point.

If you do not see it this way....just sit back in your fuzzy little p.c. world and let it continue on like it is.....this has been happening for the last 40 years...since the civil right movement and is it better now? It was probably in an overall perspective better back then....yes it was bad and unfair and hateful....but at least it was safe.....for blacks and whites...today if you are a responsible black....you have to move to a white neighborhood....good black can't even live in their own racial neighborhoods it is so bad.

You have a choice.....you can grow a set and start telling the world what you think of all this crap....or you can let the TV be your guide....I don't want my kids watching men kissing each other (this is o.k. in their homes...but not in public)....and that it is o.k. for some drunk trailer park trash to hump out a litter of kids when the hose bag can't even feed herself....or that it is o.k. to speak in ebonics to the point that i can't even under stand what the foo axed me?

Now for a happy ending: On CNN yesterday morning there was the nicest black couple you could ever find from Chicago.....I wish they were my neighbors......they dated and were engaged.....and never even kissed until thier wedding day! They wanted to save it....let the excitement build. they were both very attractive people and probably dated in the past.....but they held off. They were in their early 30's. They said that after they knew they were in love that they did not kiss because they knew they would not be able stop there. It was great the way they described their first kiss. he said it was polite but enough to get the fires stoked.... she said he really planted one on her. The news commentator asked them how long they stayed at their reception!!!! A beautiful little story.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

Well spoken Ruprick, there are many wonderful black folk that I pale in comparison to , same can be said for Mexicans, many are patriots fighting our wars. I say they breed 10 here in California to get one good one.....nice huh.

A big contributer to the separation is language, with Mexicans it's spanish and blacks it's ebonics.......these people just don't want to speak our language.
We've lost our way.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

It is more than that.....it is the good people letting it slip away without saying a word.

I was in Austria on business about 6 years ago. I was having lunch alone in a little shop that could seat about 30 people....but only about 6 people in there at the time.....meal cost would be about like a coney island here in the states.

It was a Saturday...i was in casual clothing...sitting in a corner booth with a bench seat....I was seated sideways on the bench waiting for my lunch....and i had streached out one of my legs on the bench...but was very concious to not let my foot touch the seat material (man made plastic....) ...my foot was beyond the end of the bench....

The owner came over to me and in broken english told me to turn around and sit normal. It took me back a bit at first...and i was going to explain I was aware of my shoes not touching......but i paused for about 3 seconds....and turned and sat with my foot on the floor in a "normal" manner.

This is the difference beweeen USA and the rest of most of the world....he was right and i was wrong...it was his business and i should respect his request....he had a voice and used it.

that is what we need more of here in the USA.....

If you tried that trick here with half the people they would have given him the finger and told him to stuff it....or worse.

We have slipped a long way....probably too far to turn it around.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

I was in Detroit this week.

Pretty sad to see how a city can deteriorate.

I would not want to be there when things go bad, or should I say get worse. I think things have already gone bad in Detroit.

Re: Are you ready to kill your neighbor?
 

When we stopped having enough jobs for minorities and the gov crime family targeted their neighborhoods with drugs things took this turn. It wasn't civil rights, it was predation. TPTB hit them many years before closing in on us.

A few escape, but it isn't easy. We know blacks and hispanics every bit as decent as whites. But they have to hustle harder. And reaching escape velocity is really tough. One black family we know began working for the city bus system, then paid her way through beauty and barber school and set up her shop. Now he is learning plumbing (while still working full time) to start a business where he can employ his sons.

The hispanic family one son is a plumber and one a carpenter and dad, who can do pretty much anything, trims trees. He paid really high rent to not raise his kids in a bad neighborhood. Their family values are enviable.